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Historical reality

January 21, 2013

The following are excerpts from a column written by Judge Andrew P. Napolitano, which expresses his understanding of the Second Amendment of the U.S. Constitution: The essence of humanity is freedo....

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(39)

CMReeder

Jan-23-13 1:24 PM

Clearly Mike you don't know what a strawman argument is because truthfully demanding the rights of the father is a strawman argument.

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CMReeder

Jan-23-13 1:23 PM

"Again, the woman holds all the cards and the man has to live with whatever decision she makes."

Which means you want to hold all the cards and make all the decisions.

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mikekerstetter

Jan-22-13 1:07 PM

CMReeder-"So a rapist would have fatherhood rights. The man who commits incest has fatherhood rights. All those acts are deemed criminal acts yet they are the fathers. What about the men who chose abortion for their partners instead of fatherhood? Believe it or not Mike there are plenty of those kind of men. You still want to give men fatherhood rights."

Here you with the straw man arguments again. Sure, because every woman who has an abortion was raped, right?

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mikekerstetter

Jan-22-13 1:04 PM

CMReeder"The rights of the father? Are you kidding me! You are not the one who is going to be pregnant. Men have a history of denying, abandonment, abuse."

And women don't have a history of abandoning and abuse?

Again, the woman holds all the cards and the man has to live with whatever decision she makes.

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CMReeder

Jan-22-13 9:52 AM

I have a co-worker who is so sure his guns will be taken away because Obama is president that he said he buried several of his guns in his backyard.

Kind of defeats the purpose of gun ownership. Just think this guy owns several handguns and rifles and may live next door to you.

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MrShaman

Jan-22-13 9:43 AM

"I haven't own a gun for over 40 years. I never had a occasion to use one. Raised three children and none of them own guns. Why is it necessary to own a semi automatic gun with multiple rounds. Isn't one bullet enough?" - rick424

*

You're (quite) obviously ill-prepared for the Zombie Apocalypse.

What kinda 'Merican ARE you??!!!

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CMReeder

Jan-22-13 9:25 AM

The rights of the father? Are you kidding me! You are not the one who is going to be pregnant. Men have a history of denying, abandonment, abuse. So a rapist would have fatherhood rights. The man who commits incest has fatherhood rights. All those acts are deemed criminal acts yet they are the fathers. What about the men who chose abortion for their partners instead of fatherhood? Believe it or not Mike there are plenty of those kind of men. You still want to give men fatherhood rights.

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CMReeder

Jan-22-13 9:15 AM

Enigma you are an idiot. A fetus is not a baby.

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CMReeder

Jan-22-13 9:13 AM

"When does a fetus become a baby?"

You don't like my answer Phil. It is up to the pregnant woman to decide what the answer is.

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mikekerstetter

Jan-22-13 6:30 AM

clw1162, a couple of points. We're not talking about what a woman can do with her body... we are objecting to what she is doing to the body growing inside of her.

And what about the rights of the father, the other half of the creation? Why does the woman hold all the cards? If she chooses to abort and the father wants to keep the baby, he has no say. If she chooses to keep the baby and the father doesn't want it, he is still responsible for child support for 18 years. It took 2 to conceive, but only 1 holds all the power.

And since drug addicts share dirty needles and transmit disease we should make drugs legal? That last point is a poor argument for abortion.

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clw1162

Jan-21-13 11:32 PM

Mr Enigma you are another example of why men shouldn't have any say in what a woman can do with her body....i am pro-life but it is not my right or the gov'ts right to tell a woman what she can do with her body.that would be between the woman getting the abortion and GOD.Even if abortions were made illegal do you think women would stop getting them? No they would be going to seedy germ infested rooms with a coat hanger like in the middle ages..

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DavidBross

Jan-21-13 10:56 PM

Bobbie2: Good point!! I wasn't clear. I was thinking of our country since 1776. Enigma:"If enough people agree with me, then we will take steps to remedy the situation. If enough people disagree, we will not be successful." That sounds like the recipe for a civil war.

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enigma

Jan-21-13 10:10 PM

David, So what you're saying is that as long as one person doesn't think a ruler is a tyrant, then he isn't a tyrant. Like any subjective term, tyrant is relative. If I believe a person to be a tyrant, he is a tyrant to me. If enough people agree with me, then we will take steps to remedy the situation. If enough people disagree, we will not be successful. You cannot have an absolute judgement of tyrant and you know that. Your question was meant to squash talk of tyranny. If this is not true and your question was genuine, please don't tell me. It would be a big disapointment, as I consider you to be more intelligent than that.

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DavidBross

Jan-21-13 8:47 PM

My questions are anything but sophomoric as your following quote shows. "As you know, not everyone believed that King George was a tyrant, but enough did that action was taken." To speak vaguely of "enough" in a time long past is easy. But when that idea is brought forward to today, as the letter writer did, then the question of how many are enough becomes an essential question.

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enigma

Jan-21-13 8:22 PM

David, I think that you know your questions are sophomoric, and that you ask them because you think there is no answer, but there are. As in the American Revolution, tyrants are identified as such by those living under the tyranny. As you know, not everyone believed that King George was a tyrant, but enough did that action was taken. The tyrant was not killed, but many of his represtatives were and he was removed from his position of tyranny in the colonies. A little more resently you might remember a certain tyrant in Libya. Just because we are not at that point here is no reason to give up the right to be able to defend against it. I know of no one who is saying that we should overthrow the U.S. Government now, but are you saying that it couldn't happen here, ever?

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DavidBross

Jan-21-13 5:46 PM

"It (The Second Amendment) protects the right to shoot tyrants, with the same instruments they would use upon us." OK, some questions. First, what is the process by which said tyrants are identified? Second, are there examples in our past where a tyrant was identified and shot?

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enigma

Jan-21-13 5:38 PM

Rick424,"Don't you just love conservatives. They don't feel women have any rights."

I'm all for women's rights. I support their right to vote, to equal pay, to keep and bear arms. I support all their rights, but no one has the right to kill another person who is not threatening their life. Abortion is not a God given right and those are the rights that are guaranteed in the Constitution. I don't have the right to kill someone just because it is inconvenient for me that they are alive, and I shouldn't have that right and neither should anyone else. Giving that right to people could be very dangerous because your life might be inconvenient to someone, maybe even a woman.

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enigma

Jan-21-13 5:30 PM

Chuck,"Speaking baby or fetus."

Since we're asking stupid questions: When does a fetus become a baby? When does a baby become a child? When does a child become a human? When does a human become a person?

The answer to these questions is that a fetus is a baby, a baby is a child, a child is human and all humans are persons. It follows from this that a fetus is a person.

So Chuck, do you want to play some more silly word games?

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JohnZook

Jan-21-13 2:38 PM

Since you changed the subject, human beings only create human beings. Doesn't matter which trimester the process is in, only babies come out of the birth canal. And since the father started the whole process, doesn't he have a say in the matter?

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philunderwood

Jan-21-13 11:09 AM

When does a fetus become a baby?

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CMReeder

Jan-21-13 10:31 AM

Speaking baby or fetus.

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philunderwood

Jan-21-13 10:29 AM

Women have all of there legitimate rights, but how about the baby’s right to life, Rick?

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CMReeder

Jan-21-13 10:22 AM

Don't you just love the gun loving right they can not reiterate the whole Second Amendment

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rick424

Jan-21-13 10:10 AM

Don't you just love conservatives. They don't feel women have any rights.

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coffee

Jan-21-13 9:57 AM

Don't you just love liberals, they can clearly see a right to an abortion in the Constitution where the word abortion is never mentioned. But liberals can't comprehend the meaning of the words "right to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed"!

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