Sign In | Create an Account | Welcome, . My Account | Logout | Subscribe | Submit News | Newspaper contacts | All Access E-Edition | Home RSS
 
 
 

Immigration

April 27, 2013

What could be the difference between the immigration of the late 1800’s to the early 1900’s and now? Well, for one thing, back in the day people were fleeing poverty, social unrest, and were being......

« Back to Article

 
 
sort: oldest | newest

Comments

(65)

Meredith

Apr-29-13 11:39 AM

Mike, they call themselves Christian because they believe in Christ. They are a type of Christian just like you are a type of Christian. Yes you have many different beliefs but some are similar.

1 Agrees | 2 Disagrees | Report Abuse »

pinecr

Apr-29-13 11:03 AM

Great letter!

1 Agrees | 0 Disagrees | Report Abuse »

gavinf56

Apr-28-13 5:40 PM

Mike, I agree you did denounce that, but just as the Muslims who denounce the violence are a minority so were you. Many "Christians" supported the pastor's right to "free speech" while denouncing that of the WBC.

As to why they hate us, you and I will never agree. You say it's religious based and I say it's based upon historical actions by European Christians and geo-political disagreements.

1 Agrees | 1 Disagrees | Report Abuse »

mikekerstetter

Apr-28-13 5:23 PM

gavinf56-"I suspect the moral outrage would be far different if they were protesting Muslim funerals just as many "Christians" were silent, or even supportive, on the burning of the Qur'an by a Florida pastor."

Certainly not on my part would it be different. I did, in fact, denounce the actions of the Pastor who burned the Koran and was very vocal in support of the Islamic Community Center that they wanted to put 'in the shadow' of the WTC. They have as much right to be here and practice their religion as I do and I'll support them in that right. But I won't pretend that the majority of the worlds Islamic population hates us and, at the very least, turn a blind eye to the terrorism directed towards us and at worst support it and participate in it.

0 Agrees | 0 Disagrees | Report Abuse »

gavinf56

Apr-28-13 4:53 PM

Big difference Mike. You hold a reverence for a military veteran who has given the ultimate sacrifice making the actions of the Westboro Baptist Church offensive to you. The people of the ME don't hold that same reverence for us.

I suspect the moral outrage would be far different if they were protesting Muslim funerals just as many "Christians" were silent, or even supportive, on the burning of the Qur'an by a Florida pastor.

2 Agrees | 0 Disagrees | Report Abuse »

mikekerstetter

Apr-28-13 4:08 PM

gavinf56-"Mike, perhaps their silence is driven more by a historical and geo-political animosity towards the west than it is religion based."

At least we agree they have a great dislike for the west, AKA Infidels. I'm inclined to believe their silence is because they condone the terrorism directed towards those who they dislike.

One of the things you said to me earlier in this discussion is that I was 'trying to distance' myself from someone whom you called a 'Christian Terrorist'. Yes I am. As a Christian I'm standing up and saying that the Christian faith doesn't condone someone using terrorism and other despicable actions (IE Westboro Baptist Church) in the name of Jesus Christ. And again, therein lies the difference between the majority of the Worlds Muslims and Christians.

1 Agrees | 0 Disagrees | Report Abuse »

gavinf56

Apr-28-13 3:44 PM

Mike, perhaps their silence is driven more by a historical and geo-political animosity towards the west than it is religion based.

0 Agrees | 0 Disagrees | Report Abuse »

mikekerstetter

Apr-28-13 3:18 PM

Jerry, you replied while I was writing my response to Gavin. But feel free to answer that question; If most Muslims think that killing infidels in the name of Allah and Sharia law is bad, why are they not standing up and denouncing that behavior?

2 Agrees | 2 Disagrees | Report Abuse »

mikekerstetter

Apr-28-13 3:12 PM

Just to make sure you're not misunderstanding what I'm saying.... I'm not saying that they are all participating in these killings. I'm saying they think it's OK to do as part of Islamic life.

So, if you believe most Muslims don't think killing people is a normal part of Islam, where are they standing up against the 'extremists' and denouncing that and Sharia law? I certainly don't see it happening among the world Muslim populations.

1 Agrees | 2 Disagrees | Report Abuse »

JerryfromRI

Apr-28-13 3:11 PM

@gavinf56

What's really scary is that Mike actually believes what he says.

I could try to reason with Mike until I'm blue in the face but anything I would say would just be dismissed as liberal jibber-jabber; I think it's very telling that even your libertarian street cred seems to give him no pause.

2 Agrees | 1 Disagrees | Report Abuse »

gavinf56

Apr-28-13 12:49 PM

"To the majority of the Worlds Muslims killing people in the name of Allah is normal." - mikekerstetter

Absolutely not true.

4 Agrees | 3 Disagrees | Report Abuse »

mikekerstetter

Apr-28-13 11:49 AM

gavinf56-"Well Mike, it is your attitude right there that is the reasons Christians are ridiculed, and I would have to say rightly so."

What attitude? Where do you think I am wrong it what I say?

1 Agrees | 2 Disagrees | Report Abuse »

gavinf56

Apr-28-13 8:04 AM

Well Mike, it is your attitude right there that is the reasons Christians are ridiculed, and I would have to say rightly so.

7 Agrees | 4 Disagrees | Report Abuse »

mikekerstetter

Apr-28-13 7:46 AM

My first paragraph should have said that 'most Muslims in the US are decent people who aren't going to blow you up'.....

2 Agrees | 4 Disagrees | Report Abuse »

mikekerstetter

Apr-28-13 7:45 AM

Gavin, I've said that most Muslims are decent people and aren't going to blow you up or kill you..... BUT, their religious texts do, in fact, promise reward for killing infidels in the name of Allah. And although Sharia law seems extreme to us, it's not extreme to a large part of their culture and is, again in fact, supported by their religious texts and teachings.

I work with a number of those of the Muslim faith and most are not much different than you and I. But get outside of the US and there are a majority who are 'the extreme' and they see nothing wrong with what we call terrorism.

Therein lies the difference. True Christians are called to love one another and are quick to denounce those who proclaim to act out in the name of Christ. To the majority of the Worlds Muslims killing people in the name of Allah is normal.

3 Agrees | 4 Disagrees | Report Abuse »

gavinf56

Apr-28-13 6:37 AM

"Gavin, can you elaborate? I, for one, am quick to point out groups and individuals (like Westboro Baptist Church who, in my opinion, aren't a Christian Church either) who don't follow Christian Doctrine but call themselves Christian." - mikekerstetter

Mike, many of the Christian posters here make that same argument and distance themselves from the radical Christian groups. My whole point is that they don't make that same correlation when it comes to other religions and their radical elements, and in particular Islam.

4 Agrees | 1 Disagrees | Report Abuse »

mikekerstetter

Apr-28-13 6:30 AM

gavinf56-"Mike, I agree, they are radical Christians no more associated with Christianity than radical Muslims are to Islam, but you would never know that reading what some "Christians" post here."

Gavin, can you elaborate? I, for one, am quick to point out groups and individuals (like Westboro Baptist Church who, in my opinion, aren't a Christian Church either) who don't follow Christian Doctrine but call themselves Christian.

3 Agrees | 3 Disagrees | Report Abuse »

mikekerstetter

Apr-28-13 5:51 AM

Meredith, they MAY consider themselves Christian, but "Christian Identity believers reject the beliefs of most contemporary Christian denominations" (From Wikipedia and other sources). They don't follow Christian Doctrine in their beliefs. True Christian denominations and organizations denounce Christian Identity as heresy and condemn the use of the Christian Bible as a basis for promoting white supremacy and Antisemitism. They are no more Christian than I am a Muslim.

3 Agrees | 3 Disagrees | Report Abuse »

cheyenne

Apr-28-13 12:01 AM

Look at how the inability to control immigration turned out for Native Americans. Perhaps there is something to the adage, "what goes around, comes around."

11 Agrees | 2 Disagrees | Report Abuse »

Meredith

Apr-27-13 11:14 PM

mikekerstetter, I googled the Christian Identity group and they actually consider themselves to be Christians. They believe that most Christians who don't believe the same as them are heretics and they practice white supremacy. So while they are not the same type of Christian as you, they still consider themselves Christians.

10 Agrees | 3 Disagrees | Report Abuse »

Meredith

Apr-27-13 11:00 PM

"With the attack on Christianity by the government and the acceptance of other religions, certain people will leave the country for religious and political reasons."

Sorry, but if you should not be living in America if you cannot be tolerant of other religions. All of them, not just Christianity. People have been coming to America for religious freedom since it's beginning and you can't take that away from them.

7 Agrees | 2 Disagrees | Report Abuse »

gavinf56

Apr-27-13 7:19 PM

"Gavin, 'the Christian Identity' is NOT a Christian group and they don't follow the Christian doctrine." - mikekerstetter

Mike, I agree, they are radical Christians no more associated with Christianity than radical Muslims are to Islam, but you would never know that reading what some "Christians" post here.

6 Agrees | 0 Disagrees | Report Abuse »

Bufftrev1

Apr-27-13 6:59 PM

If the discussion is about religious motivation, it may be worth noting that gw is quoted as saying he believed he was doing gods will by invading Iraq .

7 Agrees | 6 Disagrees | Report Abuse »

gavinf56

Apr-27-13 6:30 PM

Rudolph and his family were connected with the Christian Identity movement, a militant, racist and anti-Semitic organization that believes whites are God's chosen people. HE HAS CONFIRMED RELIGIOUS MOTIVATION, but denied racial motivation for his crimes.

Christian Identity is a label applied to a wide variety of loosely affiliated believers and churches with a white supremacist theology. Most promote a racist interpretation of Christianity.

Spin however you want Mike.

2 Agrees | 3 Disagrees | Report Abuse »

mikekerstetter

Apr-27-13 6:21 PM

Gavin, 'the Christian Identity' is NOT a Christian group and they don't follow the Christian doctrine. You can try to make him a 'Christian terrorist' all you want, but the TRUTH is that he was not a 'Christian'.

6 Agrees | 3 Disagrees | Report Abuse »

Showing 25 of 65 comments Show More Comments
 
 

Post a Comment

You must first login before you can comment.

*Your email address:
*Password:
Remember my email address.
or
 
 
 

 

I am looking for:
in:
News, Blogs & Events Web