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Bad joke!

September 18, 2013

House bill 1189, the Optional Property Tax Elimination Act, which was developed by Seth Grove, a Republican State Representative from the 196th District benefits the rich at the expense of the poor......

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(30)

Capricorn1

Sep-18-13 7:08 PM

LoL I've been called a lot worse!

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JerryfromRI

Sep-18-13 7:05 PM

Careful Cap, agree with me too often and people might label you a moderate.

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Capricorn1

Sep-18-13 5:36 PM

Jerry, while I would prefer just a federal sales tax and elimination of federal income tax, I also think a flat tax is a good idea. Imagine how simple it would make the tax code. No more write offs and deductions, just a straight flat tax. But we both know both ideas make too much sense and lobbyist for corporate America would speak much louder than we can.

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JerryfromRI

Sep-18-13 4:57 PM

I'm fine with an amendment to the state constitution that does away with all state and local property taxes.

And I'll repeat again my support for a flat federal income tax that taxes capital gain and income at the same rate along with the elimination of all tax deductions.

Each state would have to come up with it's own balance of income tax and sales tax to meet their requirements.

Seems pretty easy to me, not sure what all the fuss is about.

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eriklatranyi

Sep-18-13 3:59 PM

After 5 years of President Obama, the wealthy are growing wealthier and the number of poor increases.

But Mr. Reeder wants to blame anyone other the man who has been in office for the past 5 years.

I think you Mr. Reeder only excuses President Obama because he is black. That makes Mr. Reeder a racist.

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enigma

Sep-18-13 1:02 PM

Cap, A tax on commerce, whether you call it a sales tax or consumption tax was the method of taxation for most of history. The income tax is a Progressive creation. A tax on commerce is better for many reasons. First it is the fairest of all taxes. Second it is the easiest to collect and enforce. The only problem with it is that it's hard to hide just how big a bite the government is taking out of the economy with any fair tax. Let me be specific; This is not a problem for me, but it is for those who want a big government paid for by someone else.

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Capricorn1

Sep-18-13 12:44 PM

Enigma, I also agree that HB76 is the better of the two.

Cave, I like the idea of a consumption tax. In fact, I think federal income tax should be replaced with a consumption tax. I know many would disagree but I think it's the fairest way to tax everyone. The rich purchase more so they would pay more and it would also allow the 49% that pay no federal income tax to pay their share.

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CaveFelem

Sep-18-13 12:29 PM

@Capricorn1 - thanks for the tip, there's also a list of newly taxable goods and services, like food items not on the WIC list, personal hygiene products (not a big fan of this), and this one stuck out: clothing and shoes, individual items over $50. That will certainly pull in the $100 Hilfiger pant people.

I also noticed that caskets, burial vaults, and funeral issues would be taxed. That will certainly hit everyone at some point or another.

This gets us closer to a broad based consumption tax, which everyone pays, even people who live on cash businesses, as they eventually buy something.

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enigma

Sep-18-13 11:41 AM

Cap, I would really prefer to keep education funding at the local level, because that gives locals incentive to control the spending, but as property tax elimination bills are concerned, this looks like one of the better ones. I don't give it much chance of passing though. Many in richer districts will put up a big fight. There are a lot of things at play in the whole school funding thing that will work against it. But of the two bills, I prefer this one.

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Capricorn1

Sep-18-13 11:14 AM

Enigma, check out The Property Tax Independence Act (HB76). IMO this is the Bill people should get behind. It raises the sales tax from 6% to 7% and increases state income tax from 3.07 to 4.34%. It eliminates property tax completely. Check it out and let me know your thoughts.

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Garben78

Sep-18-13 11:02 AM

And ahhh the eliminate property tax is brought up. I'd say after the pig rendell promised that gaming revenue would eliminate property tax and failed to do so they any reduction would be greatly welcomed

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Garben78

Sep-18-13 10:59 AM

Tell us how party jumping chucky the rich are gonna get richer from this bill

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enigma

Sep-18-13 10:01 AM

Let me add that if the bill required that these taxes would require the elimination of property tax, it would be more acceptable, but the bill requires only that the new tax 'offset' property taxes. That is dangerous language in the hands of a politician. If you don't want to read the bill, I'll tell you what it does. It gives school districts the same taxing authority that municipalities now have. It also contains a loophole that would allow the school district to raise taxes almost without limit. While it's not necessarily a bad idea overall, it is a bad bill.

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enigma

Sep-18-13 9:34 AM

Have any of you read the bill? It's obvious that the letter writer hasn't, because much of what he says about it is wrong. That doesn't mean that it is a good bill, it is not. It is actually much worse that the letter says. It is a business killer, as if PA didn't have enough reasons for businesses not to come here. Without business, good luck even having income to tax. It basically gives a school district the power to tax every dollar that dares show its face anywhere within the district. I've seen this kind of thing before. The new tax is levied, the property taxes go down, but only for a year or two, then they're right back where they were and the new tax just keeps going up too. It's a windfall for schools and a big loss for taxpayers.

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CMReeder

Sep-18-13 9:21 AM

It is the fault of conservatives. The wealthy are more important than the poor.

Eric you are the buffoon of the wealthy.

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eriklatranyi

Sep-18-13 9:17 AM

Mr. Reeder:

You are such an ignorant tool of the left!

Under President Obama, the wealthy have gotten wealthier and the poor have increased.

Another example of liberal failure!

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CMReeder

Sep-18-13 8:29 AM

The wealthy will get wealthier and the poor will become even poorer. That is what passes as fair to conservatives.

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eriklatranyi

Sep-18-13 7:40 AM

The author claims this will cause the poor to pay more for goods and services.

That is true.

However, let us discuss what taxpayers already pay that benefits the poor:

Welfare Food Stamps Medicaid CHip Obamaphones Heating Assistance Transportation Assistance Housing Assistance Tuition Assistance Occupational Training Subsidized Breakfast & Lunch (schools)

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Garben78

Sep-18-13 7:15 AM

We considering the rich are like what 2-3% of our population this bill will definitely spread the tax burden equally. I'm not no millionaire nor do I care but if I earned my money I shouldn't be taxed more then anyone else. You want to talk racism. This is supposed to be the land of opportunity not the land of punishment because you do well. I have a good job a nice house and I buy things i need to live things to fix my house and car etc. I don't however*****the system for welfare and buy expensive jeans at social security payers and taxpayers expense I don't put $4000 rims on my junk caprice(formerly a cop car) I don't put spinners on I don't have kids knowing dang well I can't afford them etc etc etc so for sure this bill will go a long way in spreading the tax base equally period...

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idiottwo

Sep-18-13 6:43 AM

I wonder what % of the reported poor pay taxes? What % of taxes are covered by the wealthy?

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wwhickok

Sep-18-13 6:36 AM

And yes, I'm aware those figures I just used as an example are extremel unrealistic, but I'm sure you can get my drift.

Money doesn't make someone better than someone else, but at the same time, being poor doesn't mean you should automatically be put at the front of the line in the Priority Dept. There's gotta be a certain equality to things.

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wwhickok

Sep-18-13 6:34 AM

The REASON Everyone is overtaxed however is because of the welfare fodder that don't want to work so they sit home and collect food stamps.

Listen, regardless of what people think, there's some good people that just need a little help so they get it via Welfare (for the record, no, I am not one of those people), but they're still working. I don't have a problem with what Welfare is SUPPOSED to be about. I have a problem, like I think most of us do, with what Welfare IS about.

As far as this bill is concerned, I'm not going to sit here and remotely suggest I understand taxes. I know they take out about 1/4 of my paycheck every time I get paid, who knows what everything is for, at this point, who cares.. I think everyone should be taxed equally, I don't care if you make 1,000 a year or 10,000,000, but when I say equally, I'm talking about a % not a $ amount. You can't tax someone who makes 10k a year 9k and then turn around and tax someone who makes 10M a year a total of 9k.

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CarlHiller

Sep-18-13 6:30 AM

"House Bill 1189 would not tax income derived from capital gains, dividends and interest that are primarily the exclusive domain of the wealthy who would dearly love to have school property taxed on their estates and mansions lowered." These should be taxed to eliminate property taxes. Most people earn their incomes from wages and salaries. They go to work at job-sites, the convenience stores, fast food restaurants, offices, etc and should not have their wages taxed if capital gains are not. Many of well off receive the majority of their income from capital gains in investments. There is no reason to exempt capital gains from this.

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wwhickok

Sep-18-13 6:29 AM

Vince, with all due respect, I'm so tired of people acting like the poor AREN'T overtaxed. However, to your point, so is everyone else.

As far as property tax, I don't own a house, probably never will, but why the **** should someone who buys a house, have to pay someone else taxes for land THEY own? That is flat out stupid, I've never understood it, I never will, it doesn't make sense. The government doesn't own the earth the house is built on, the owner of the house does (if we're being technical).

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Tgrammiex4

Sep-18-13 6:29 AM

I have no problem with everyone paying school taxes. Ultimately the burden would still be put on the working folk, as they would just raise the welfare handouts to cover the tax.

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