To our military, to be read as Gunnery Sargent R. Lee Ermey would speak it: I am a Citizen of the United States of America and this is my military....
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It's not about personal opinions actually. If it was, "Don't ask, don't tell" would still be in place as a compromising policy. However, opinions don't count, including majority. As for polls, I am suspect as to the question asked, the cultural makeup of the demographics of the poll, and the pollster. That's something valuable I was taught in college. For me, it is deeper than this. Sodomy, which is called sin by God, period. Your argument that at one time, inter-racial marriages were condemned by churches is true, but interracial marriages are not sin, not in the Bible. Homosexuality is sin and it won't change over time.
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"Can you ******* believe it! Some ignorant ************* conservative disagreed to my personal experience of having to*****and wipe my ass in front of other people in Navy boot camp! How is it possible to disagree to someone else's personal real life experience? Is that ******* possible?" 46IQ
Grow up & get over it.
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FortySixand2 - 11:05 AM
"And I do remember the $600 hammers being purchased during the Reagan years."
As someone who worked in Procurement and Production for the DOD, I can tell you the $600 hammers, $500 toilet seats, etc., were from back in the early 60's.
But, nice try blaming Reagan!
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Two of you in how many millions that have served do not a majority make." - rmiller
That is true, and the same would also apply to you. So now we are back to nothing more than personal experiences and opinions.
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Forty, why don't you relax. You don't alienate yourself because you're a liberal, You do it because of your attacking style approach at anyone that disagrees with you, the same reason Shaman lost all respect by many. Is that the way you taught your children to resolve conflict? If not then why do you choose to do it? You boast about your manliness and threaten to go to people's houses and punch them in the face if they make a statement you don't like. Do you really think you're intimidating anyone? If anything, it makes people respect you even less. This is a very conservative leaning town as evident by these comments, you want to impress me, stand your ground with your liberal views in an adult way, regardless of how someone like Bobbie may choose to attack you. Trust me, I've been called many things on these boards by some, the best way to shut them up is to respond with respect and show them that their hatred has no effect.
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USA, your post only reaffirms many who know this CIC does not like our military - it's one of his many nemeses that he doesn't have the wherewithal to sign away with the stroke of a pen, so let's try the ever provocative economic deprivation....that should slow down incentives for re-enlistment or enlistment. And, to think, they are protecting him as they fight and die to keep him in the manner he's been accustomed to as a community organizer.
Two of you in how many millions that have served do not a majority make.
You have become increasingly hostile over the past couple of weeks. You have a mouth like a gutter rat. You're condescending attitude is not attractive and your almost cold embittered spirit, IMO...makes JH look like a saint. Some have thought you to be JH long ago and I said, "No, JH is not that nice." Wow, have times changed, along with the dialect. Take some lessons from Scott, Spike, BuffTRev, and some other mild mannered progressives. At least their verbal exchanges are worth not only hearing, but noting and learning from.
September 01, 2013
According to an article by Rick Maze of the Military Times, President Obama has notified Congress that he intends to use his authority to set the 2014 military pay increase at 1 percent, rather than the 1.8 percent, which is currently required by the federal pay formula.
The 2014 military pay raise is only one of many defense budget issues that has lawmakers and President at odds. The House budget plan includes the 1.8 percent raise, while both the Senate Armed Services Committee and the President’s proposed budgets include a cap of 1 percent.
The President announced the move on Friday August 30, right before the Labor Day weekend.
So basically what you're saying is, it's ok to force men to shower with known gay men, but it's not ok to force women to shower with heterosexual men? Why aren't men afforded the same privacy as women? The natural response is the same in either situation.
I gotta agree with FortySixand2, we didn't care if anyone was gay or not, and we knew of at least one individual who was. This was the early-mid 1980's and he was an admin in our special ops unit.
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On only using two crappers wasn't just my choice. It was the Recruit Company Commanders who made the rules. You have 80 guys in your recruit company and you only use 2 urinals and 2 crappers. That was the rule. Totally embarrassing to take a crap and wipe in front of maybe four or five other recruits telling you to hurry up because you're only given 10 minutes for a coke, joke, smoke break. Seriously! Nobody gave a crap about if anyone was gay. It was never discussed. Why is it that cons have the biggest problem with gays? That speaks to some sort of socio-psycho-patho problem.
But I did know one that was openly serving and did not only make a pass at me, but did eye me in the bathroom. Your choices to use one or two stalls was just that, a choice. As for swallowing pride....uhhh...there is nothing wrong with privacy. Your claim that perhaps there were closet homosexuals serving when anyone served and didn't know it? That's the way we wanted it to stay. Knowing it, doesn't change things and indeed provokes the individual who is the norm in life, that is not good for morale.
Oh come on now! I guarantee you guys served with homosexual servicemembers. But you never knew it! Of course, there were one or two gay men when I served that I strongly suspected, but it didn't matter. They did their jobs and I did mine. I absolutely never felt anyone eyeing my junk in the shower. What bugged the crap out of me was having to take a crap in front of other recruits! Seriously! There must've been ten crappers in the head, no privacy stalls. And we only used one or two so we didn't have to keep cleaning all of them. It made perfect sense except for when you had to go, there might be several others as well. So you swallowed your pride and dignity and did your business.
Just as a woman/man have the legal right not to endure on job harassment from a member of the opposite sex, the same principle and law should apply to same sex attraction.
With response to people serving in our military with same sex attractions. "Don't ask, don't tell" (even though I didn't like that proposal, either) was the compromise. It wasn't enough, as is usual. The push, went forward to, "I am telling and now you have to accept it."
I was in the military and when we were going through basic training, taking showers with then homosexuals, was the exact measurement as taking showers with a member of the opposite sex. If indeed, you parallel the strength of our military with homosexuals serving openly, with readiness and preparedness for combat, then you are assuming that sexual orientation in no way compromises the field duty. When I was only in basic training and a member of the same sex, eyed me in like manner as a member of the opposite sex does (as in undressing me) and or in/out of shower proved very uncomfortable, what do you suggest bolsters security and sound mind? And, that was only basic training, not
Forty- real men don't want to be forced to accept openly gay men "doin' their thing". It is naturally disgusting and there is no room in a highly disciplined military for distractions. Real lefty's "feel" that what ever one feels good to do, everyone must accept it or be scorned, ridiculed, and branded as different.
"RMiller, what you take for anger is just me giving back in kind."
But, I remember when you didn't...just saying....
By the way, military pay is based the Employment Cost Index, not the whims of a particular President or Congress. Found it on the "internets". So the argument that D's under pay is bunk, and I suspect the R's knew that but didn't care because they "own" military service dontchaknow!
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That's a rather insightful explanation, Capricorn. Do you see the irony in any of that? So it's about "what's in it for me" after all. I do recall soooo many times the R's are worried about the D's giving $ to certain constituencies so as to create "dependencies". How is this not the same thing? But directly to the point of military funding....Democratic Presidents tend to go for more post cold war military budgets because there won't be any more WWII type engagements. This is hi tech warfare time. And I do remember the $600 hammers being purchased during the Reagan years. And that is also a major point of military budgets...what are we really being charged for and which congress critter is feeding pork to which home district contractor? So it's not a matter of who's paying the most into budgets, it's what are we getting for our money? I served my time under Reagan and recall a few of those years getting very scant raises.
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Forty, democrats believe in less military spending, republicans believe in more. Republican administrations gave larger military pay raises, Reagan gave us a 12% raise just in one year. So who do you think servicemen and women are going to support, regardless of the group of liberal sailors you chose to associate with. Personally the majority of Marines and Sailors I knew in my 21 years as a Marine and 7 years as a contractor working directly with Marines and Sailors, were Republicans. Just because you are in the service, doesn't mean you no longer have a right to vote or be affiliated with a political party. And as a voter it is your responsibility to be educated about the people you are voting for. If you chose to not be interested in the leadership in DC whose decisions directly impacted your life and your family's life, then that's really too bad.
Capricornhole1, what is wrong with my words here that you find "totally disrespectful"? Maybe you object to my creative use of your username? How's it feel? Boobie2 NEVER posts unless doing so, so why do you now finally object when its directed at you? Until those of you on the right get the Admin to stop Boobie2 from doing so, I'm coming at you with guns a blazin...so to speak. So you are now capricornhole, gavin is scatwipe, Enigma will be Enema, USABorn will be USA****, gee this is going to be fun! -Forty
You REALLY need to grow up. And just to be clear, Bobbie and I did have a "conversation" regarding reigning it in and trying to show a little more respect. I suggested to her that her comments would go a lot further and have more credibility if she dialed it back. The manner in which you post shows nothing but desperation because you choose to lash out at everyone that doesn't agree with you.
****! John ZOOK, you really worried some dudes going to check out your junk? That is funny! Man, that has some serious connotations if that's how you frame people being gay. Homophobia much? If you have to worry some gay dude is checkin you out, I'd say maybe you have some doubts about your own sexuality hidden somewhere up there in that grey matter. Just sayin....
"Conservatism" in the military? Explain? I saw and experienced nothing overtly political one way or the other. I believe this is just another example of cons "owning" something, as in the power of suggestion makes it so. If anything, service in the military can be viewed as anathema to conservatism. Group over self. Unit cohesion. Teamwork. Socialism. Government employment. Government Doctors, Dentists, Lawyers, etc.
Proudly served 5 yrs US Navy, 2nd Class Petty Officer(E5), Good Conduct Medal, Meritorious Unit Commendation, Presidential Unit Citation, Sea Service Deployment(2), Navy Battle E(3), Expert Marksman Rifle (M-16), Sharpshooter (.45)
RMiller, what you take for anger is just me giving back in kind.
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